Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

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adam10185
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Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by adam10185 » Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:32 am

Hi all, following the success of my last appeal for information back in September I now have a complete list of all chassis/engine combinations of the podium finishers back to 1991.

I would however like to see how far I can go back with this, ideally back to the start of the 1000cc era in 1975 and the F2 era in 1984.
I have quite a lot of the information already but would appreciate it if anyone could help fill in the blanks. I have the engines for all the below just not the chassis. I know there are quite a few but figured i'd give it a go......if you dont ask you dont get. :-)

Finally, I should add i'm not expecting to fill every gap but the more I could get the better, nice to have things recorded correctly as most of the time they are only listed under an entrant name and not the full chassis/engine combination. Thanks in advance.

Post updated 03/01/2018 to show answers given below, those still to find are in red


1000cc/1300cc class 1975-1989, help needed with chassis
1989 Dave Molyneux – Ireson Yamaha
1986 Dave Hallam/John Gibbard - Windle Yamaha
1983 Keith Cousins/Philip Hookham – Windle Yamaha
1983 Roy Hanks/Don Williams – GPD Yamaha
1982 Roy Hanks/Vince Biggs – GPD Yamaha
1982 Steve Abbott/Shaun Smith - Windle Yamaha
1981 Mick Boddice/Chas Birks – Ireson Yamaha
1981 Derek Bayley/Bob Bryson – Winstanley Yamaha
1981 Dick Greasley/Stewart Atkinson – Busch Yamaha
1981 Roy Hanks/Vince Biggs – GPD Yamaha
1980 Dick Greasley/John Parkins – Busch Yamaha
1979 Dave Saville/Hugh Sanderson - Yamaha
1979 Rolf Steinhausen/Kenny Arthur - MSA1
1979 Mick Boddice/Chas Birks – Woodhouse Yamaha
1979 Dick Greasley/John Parkins – Busch Yamaha
1978 Dick Greasley/Gordon Russell – Busch Yamaha
1978 Rolf Steinhausen/Wolfgang Kalauch – Busch Yamaha
1978 Jock Taylor/Kenny Arthur – Windle Yamaha
1978 Rolf Biland/Ken Williams - Beo Yamaha
1978 Mick Boddice/Chas Birks – Woodhouse Yamaha
1978 Graham Milton/John Brushwood – British Magnum
1977 George O’Dell/Kenny Arthur – Windle Yamaha
1977 Mac Hobson/Stuart Collins – Windle Yamaha
1977 Dick Greasley/Michael Skeels - Windle Yamaha
1977 Rolf Biland/Ken Williams - Schmidt Yamaha
1977 Rolf Steinhausen/Wolfgang Kalauch – Busch Konig
1976 Mac Hobson/Mick Burns – Windle Yamaha
1976 Siegfried Schauzu/Wolfgang Kalauch – Busch BMW
1976 Rolf Steinhausen/Joseph Huber - Busch Konig
1976 Dick Greasley/Cliff Holland – Windle Yamaha
1975 Siegfried Schauzu/Wolfgang Kalauch – Busch BMW
1975 Dick Greasley/Cliff Holland – Windle Yamaha
1975 Mac Hobson/Gordon Russell - Windle Yamaha
1975 Gerry Boret/Nick Boret – Renwick Konig


Also would like some clarity around the Barton Phoenix entry, its my understanding this was the engine only, does anyone know what chassis Nigel Rollason was using at the time?


F2 Class 1984-1990, help needed with chassis
1990 Dave Saville/Nick Roche - Yamaha
1989 Norman Burgess/Nicholas Kay – Jacobs Yamaha
1989 Dennis Keen/Rob Parker - Yamaha
1989 Roy Hanks/Malcolm Lucas – Ireson Yamaha
1989 Dave Saville/Richard Crossley - Yamaha
1988 Dennis Keen/Rob Parker – Yamaha
1988 Dave Saville/Dave Hall - Yamaha
1987 Roy Hanks/Tom Hanks – NRTH Yamaha
1987 Dave Saville/Dave Hall - Yamaha
1987 Bill Hodgkins/Sean Collister – Windle Yamaha
1987 John Hartell/Nick Roche – (Hopper or Shelbourne) Armstrong
1986 Roy Hanks/Alistair Frame – NRH Yamaha
1986 Bill Hodgkins/Sean Collister – Windle Yamaha
1986 Pat Gallagher/Andrew Cawdell - Derbyshire Yamaha
1986 Colin Hopper/Norman Burgess – Hopper Armstrong
1985 Dave Saville/Dave Hall – Derbyshire Yamaha
1985 Roy Hanks/Malcolm Lucus – NRH Yamaha
1984 Cliff Pritchard/Kevin Morgan – Yamaha
1984 Dick Fletcher/Chris Shaw – Windle Yamaha
1984 Dave Saville/Dave Hall - Yamaha
1984 Brian Latham/Kathy Latham - Yamaha

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AL
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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by AL » Mon Dec 11, 2017 8:08 pm

1989 Dave Molyneux /Colin Hardman/ Ireson Yamaha, sponsor was Eric Breggazi .

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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by Big Tim » Mon Dec 11, 2017 8:22 pm

From this period in time, you will find that, certainly pre-1985, many chassis were "home built", so their origins may be difficult to trace. There will have been a fair few Windle,Ireson and Busch chassis used at the timescale listed by those teams, (plus also a couple of Hopper chassis looking at the F2 list). Hopefully you will get some more confirmed answers - I could take a fairly informed guess at some of those, but wouldn't be able to guarantee their accuracy.

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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by Dan » Mon Dec 11, 2017 9:14 pm

Pat Gallagher had a new Derbyshire chassis (TZ350 yamaha engine) for the 1985 TT so it could have been the the same used in 1986. If it wasn't the same chassis I am fairly certain it would have been a Derbyshire he was riding, can't guarantee it 100% though.
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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by adam10185 » Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:52 am

Thanks for the replies so far, as mentioned above i'm not expecting to fill all the gaps, i know anything pre 1980 ish may be difficult to trace but even around this time there were still a lot of Windle/Ireson chassis around. If i could at least go back to the start of that decade i would be happy.

Just a couple of additional questions (excuse my ignorance here)......
Its my understanding the Barton Phoenix name just relates to the engine? do we know what chassis was used.

Dave Saville is listed in 1986 as winning on a Sabre Windle machine, again its my understanding that both Sabre and Windle were chassis and not engines? Could anyone confirm....

Thanks again

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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by ronno » Tue Dec 12, 2017 1:03 am

1981 Derek Bayley / Bob Bryson - Yamaha

Can confirm Chassis was Winstanley

I know for sure because I collected it from Vince Winstanley in Wigan in November 1980,was due to attend a residential training course at RTITB ,High Ercall , Shropshire, so set off from Folkestone in Derek's Transit and diverted via Wigan , it sat in the back of the van for 3 days while I was on the course. We met up with Vince in a pub during 1981 TT , think Vince was happy as 3rd place might have been highest placing for one of his Chassis ?

Was also same chassis in 1982.(4th , so not quite on podium ) ;)
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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by ronno » Tue Dec 12, 2017 1:13 am

adam10185 wrote:Thanks for the replies so far, as mentioned above i'm not expecting to fill all the gaps, i know anything pre 1980 ish may be difficult to trace but even around this time there were still a lot of Windle/Ireson chassis around. If i could at least go back to the start of that decade i would be happy.

Just a couple of additional questions (excuse my ignorance here)......
Its my understanding the Barton Phoenix name just relates to the engine? do we know what chassis was used.

Dave Saville is listed in 1986 as winning on a Sabre Windle machine, again its my understanding that both Sabre and Windle were chassis and not engines? Could anyone confirm....

Thanks again
I think this explains , Adam ...
Sabre Engineering was a partnership with Dave Saville and Fred Brindley and the Brindley family , hence the Sabre name.
Chassis was Windle.
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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by adam10185 » Tue Dec 12, 2017 2:11 am

Cheers ronno, Im taking this to mean Sabre was only the entrant name then and not the engine?

Again apologies for my ignorance. Not quite as clued up as some of you guys. :-)

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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by lang » Tue Dec 12, 2017 11:34 am

Here are the ones I know.
1989 Dave Molyneux Ireson
1983 Keith Cousins Windle
1981 Mick Boddice Ireson
1981 Derek Bayley Winstanley
1981 Dick Greasley Busch
1980 Dick Greasley Busch
1979 Dick Greasley Busch
1978 Rolf Steinhausen Busch
1978 Jock Taylor Windle
1978 Graham Milton Made by Milton
1977 George O"Dell Windle
1977 Mac Hobson Schmid
1977 Rolf Biland Schmid
1977 Rolf Steinhausen Busch
1976 Siegfried Schauzu race 1 Busch BMW race 2 Fath ARO
1975 Gerry Boret BRS

1989 Norman Burgess Jacobs
1987 Bill Hodgkins Windle
1987 John Hartell Hopper or Shelbourne
1986 Bill Hodgkins Windle
1986 Pat Gallagher Derbyshire
1986 Colin Hopper Hopper
1984 Dick Fletcher Windle

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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by steve-e » Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:05 pm

Now we know where Tim gets it from :lol: :notworthy: :notworthy:
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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by ronno » Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:50 pm

adam10185 wrote:Cheers ronno, Im taking this to mean Sabre was only the entrant name then and not the engine?

Again apologies for my ignorance. Not quite as clued up as some of you guys. :-)
Correct Adam :D No problem :D :beer:
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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by ronno » Tue Dec 12, 2017 1:05 pm

I don't want to start a family argument ;) , but for Gerry Boret 1975 , Howard says BRS while Tim says Renwick.

Again I have to admit to a bit of inside knowledge , a new 'BRS' was built over the winter of 1975/1976 , and was used for the Boret Brothers last TT in 76 (DNF X 2) , swapping from Konig in 75 to Yamaha in 76 , after the October 75 Brands Hatch meeting Derek's Yamaha engine was removed in the paddock and taken by Gerry to be used as a template , then 2 outfits were built, one for Gerry and Nick Boret , one for Derek and Peter Bayley.
I can't be sure , but assume the Boret's 75 Konig outfit was still a Renwick chassis.
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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by adam10185 » Tue Dec 12, 2017 2:40 pm

Many many thanks for all your help so far guys, really think we can get this finished, mainly the 1000cc class.

I have ammended the original post with those answers already given.

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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by tonybsa2008 » Tue Dec 12, 2017 8:51 pm

1976 Mac Hobson,was on a Windle,and also in 1977,he got the Schmid in 1978,I am sure Mike Crawford can confirm/correct this.Dick Greasley will have been on the Busch in 1978,in 1977 he may still have been on his Windle,in 1975 definently on the Windle..Hope this helps.

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Re: Sidecar TT missing chassis/engine Part 2

Unread post by lang » Wed Dec 13, 2017 11:09 am

I remember at the Yamaha product launch for the new 1977 machines, Ray Hamilton saying that he had bought the Schmid, and that Rolf Biland was also using one.
I seem to remember that the Borets 1975 chassis was the "Renwick" look alike they built, it had a quite different swing arm pivot system to the Renwick. I think that Ian Waugh later owned this chassis.

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