The Place

Dean,

As you know im not happy with the current F1 situation but sticking 600's in our chassis is definate No No!! It would be totally uncompetitive...

As for big bikes not blowing up, I can only speak from personal experience but ive used 2 engines for 4yrs and not one has let me down! But my point was the long chassis would stress the engines a lot more than a conventional chassis!!

One thing we do need to find is a cheap formula for sidecar racing because the numbers are dwindling fast!!

Phil

Phil said "One thing we do need to find is a cheap formula for sidecar racing " - and not go down the F2 route again

My goodness I'm feeling a deja vous moment coming on

The great thing is Dean we'll never agree so it can go on for years

now this is goiing to stir shit !!!!!!!!!!!!!!,
if you put 600 engines in a long bike !!!!!!!
from my experience even on a 350,most people who start on long bikes cant ride the bloody things !!!,bad enough some riders on big engined long bikes,
KEEP F2 on conventional chassies and standard engines and ignitions and restrict the rear tyre width

We're going to have to change the title of this thread, there's no way we can split it fairly but we don't want Dave thinking there are loads of people talking about him on t'interweb.
Still makes for interesting reading, but we're definitely off topic

Tis funny reading these

Bruce reckons "KEEP F2 on conventional chassies and standard engines and ignitions and restrict the rear tyre width"

Thereby creating a new and relatively inexpensive class but widen engine choice to include strokers and other diesels apart from four cyl jobbies

I'll get me beret, pastis & suncream ...

To bring this back on topic ( sort of ) , Moly and me tried long 600s along with Derek Rumble, Artie Oats, Gordon Shand and one or two others at the 91 TT. They were a bit numb to ride with not just low power but not much torque either. They were ok at the TT and had we been a bit more clued up with carburation, (ie used flat slides instead of CV carbs) we might have won. On short circuits we managed to get in the top 6 in the british F2 but it wasnt very exiting to ride. Regarding Dave and Patrick at TT 2012 it would be great to see them have a double on the Kwaka.

I remember those first long 600s they were as Geoff say's a bit numb, a good 350 could see them off.

The engines have improved tremendously since then. Maybe it's not such a bad idea, it would get rid of the huge stretch over the handlebars to the air box too.

Bob B wrote:Bruce reckons "KEEP F2 on conventional chassies and standard engines and ignitions and restrict the rear tyre width"

Thereby creating a new and relatively inexpensive class but widen engine choice to include strokers and other diesels apart from four cyl jobbies

I'll get me beret, pastis & suncream ...

Forgive if I`m wrong(I often am) but is`nt Bob`s idea the original concept of F2, strokers, 600`s, twins up to 1000, what a diversity and how much more interesting to all especially spectators.

probably,but its also the genaral concept of the original class which has been ruined

Bruce. I've just got back from the Speedway at Brandon.. great night by the way.
You've been busy !

bruce moore wrote:probably,but its also the genaral concept of the original class which has been ruined

Does that mean then that come Hell or High water F2 will always be 600`s even if as we can see, that people are not happy with it,well then sound the death knell,or try and change stuff.

petercaughlin wrote:

bruce moore wrote:probably,but its also the genaral concept of the original class which has been ruined

Does that mean then that come Hell or High water F2 will always be 600`s even if as we can see, that people are not happy with it,well then sound the death knell,or try and change stuff.

No class stays the same forever. One thing that will dictate the class will be availability of engines. If people are not buying motorbikes, they're not crashing them and hence there are fewer bikes to be broken. I think we have 600's now because that was the most readily available engine at the time. I personally think 750's would have been a good size for a single, joint class but the manufacturers no longer make them in any quantity so there wouldn't have been enough engines.
Personally speaking, I don't think the basis of the class is wrong (.i.e. steel tubular chassis, road bike engines and no exotic materials). Where it has gone wrong is with the expensive tuning aids that have put the cost beyond the average working guy.
Incomes are, at best, static. Costs are still increasing. When costs exceed income people stop racing. People are stopping racing, it's happening guys and we seem to be sleepwalking into oblivion.
I'm glad I've had my day but I fear for the future.