The Place

If any one has any photos of either Gerry Boret or George Odell's Renwick to aide the restoration i am currently carrying out either with or without bodywork, although without would be more useful. I have most of the technical info and the outfit is in reasonable condition its mainly for detail work any help would be appreciated regards Konig freak

lets see some pics then

Hi
Have you asked John?
I think he has his fibreglass molds back. Gerry still have his? I could ask John Langridge, he helped build them but sold his a very long time ago.
Chris

Thanks Chris I am seeing John Renwick in the new year which should help, sadly Gerry Boret is no longer with us and I believe his outfit went to Australia. however there is nothing like original photos for the placement of all the little bits and pieces.
regards Konig Freak

I remember most owners of Renwick chassis, George O'Dell included, complained of chronic bump steer, and the only slight improvement they could make was to run the suspension almost rigid, leading to many frame fractures. This is one reason why their success on the track was very limited, and prompted me to order a Windle chassis for my Konig in 1975.

Ian had posted some earlier this year..

viewtopic.php?f=13&t=34862

and Bob found the link for both sides of the cutaway

http://msrphotographic.co.uk/html/photo_page_479.html

http://msrphotographic.co.uk/html/photo_page_480.html

Also

http://www.mortonsarchive.com/?Action=V ... d=94089bdp

This "Bump steer" issue always comes up, I can tell you that when the Renwick was set up as per Mr Renwick's instructions bump steer is impossible. The Renwick came 3 rd at the IOM in 1972 I think it was, "Bump steering," I do not think so some how.

I think my father knows what he's talking about. I also think Mr O'Dell probably did too.

RARING TO GO wrote:This "Bump steer" issue always comes up, I can tell you that when the Renwick was set up as per Mr Renwick's instructions bump steer is impossible. The Renwick came 3 rd at the IOM in 1972 I think it was, "Bump steering," I do not think so some how.

Mr Duneige, take it from somebody who has actually raced sidecars competitively (unlike yourself) Renwick chassis did suffer from this problem. The word from those who did the TT on them was to stick to the middle of the road as much as possible so as to leave room for correction.

Howard are the CRMC going to let you ride the Konig with them next year. I can't understand why it was not allowed in this year !

It's probably not because they're rubbish. Most machines not allowed in the CRMC are declared ineligible as they don't conform to the original concept of the class when the CRMC Sidecar Class was put together - because they would open a floodgate that would make one type of machine render too many of the others uncompetitive.
The skill required of an eligibility officer is to decide where to draw a line by interpreting the original concept of the formula, which has opened the class up over the years to different periods within the class.

My opinion anyway - as someone who spent years at CRMC in the early days of the sidecar class from the beginning until the late 80's - not racing but there when Dad was racing with his NSU outfit. The reason Dad went to the classic club with the NSU was that there was no point being in the same race as the fast TZ's, so racing somewhere they weren't allowed was a more enjoyable experience.

Surely the CRMC have nothing to fear with their 1972 cut off point as far as frames are concerned, we saw all sorts of wierd devices come and go, in the time. The only really dramatic thing that happened to sidecar racing didn't take place until '75/'76 when the Yams came, or am I being naive here. I don't understand the '67 cut of point for two strokes either, as we were quite happy racing our BSAs, Triumphs and Wessies against them until the Yams.

I'm sure they had their reasons Bill. You could ask Bobert as he had a part in the original regs, the rules back then seemed designed to exclude certain machinery, the reasons for which may have been lost in the passing of time. The CRMC sidecars started when? I think Dad's first season might have been about 81/2 ish? I'm pretty sure I was working in the commentary box with Allan Robinson(MBE!) when I was about 14 or 15 which would've been 81/2 (all this is 'ish,) - so at that time the cut off probably was easier to set and made with less rosey lenses

steve-e wrote:I'm sure they had their reasons Bill. You could ask Bobert as he had a part in the original regs, the rules back then seemed designed to exclude certain machinery, the reasons for which may have been lost in the passing of time. The CRMC sidecars started when? I think Dad's first season might have been about 81/2 ish? I'm pretty sure I was working in the commentary box with Allan Robinson(MBE!) when I was about 14 or 15 which would've been 81/2 (all this is 'ish,) - so at that time the cut off probably was easier to set and made with less rosey lenses

Sure Steve, I accept all of what you say, but the '60s and '70s were a very exciting time for sidecar racing and with no dominant engines much innovation was involved, especially in frame construction, but also with engines such as SAABs, DKW/Auto Unions, Wartburgs, Fiats, Minis, S800, NSUs, you name it, if it existed it was tried by someone. That is not at all reflected in classic racing of today, especially the frame variations. In fact there are no frame variations involved today, to my knowledge, everything is the same, the only difference being the bent tubes. That is grossly unfair and if relaxed could possibly bring out a few more outfits with an obvious bit of variation to the line. Why this frightens people I do not know, they are not going to be any more competitive than they were in the period. Bob is going to tell me about Rudi going round the outside of him at Gerrards on his Honda Cat, so probably would Pip Harris or Colin Seeley on whatever they were on. I'm sticking my neck out here, as I don't know how quick Bob and his partner were, but Rudi did not upset everybody everyday, as like all of these creations they are never usually very reliable. How it can be ok to build new 1040 or whatever BMWs tuned to todays standard, with brand new frames built with today's materials, using ride height adjustment, which everybody had in the '60s and '70s modern suspension units et all. You'll be telling me next we can't get hold of Mini rubbers?