After that explanation Bob I can see it makes so much sence in keeping the " modern " 2 strokes out of not only the solo classes but also the sidecar class.
Your point about depleated grids, that's where Forgotten Era went wrong & in my opinion was the demise of the class. They let in Jap multi 4 strokes which damaged the class, but then when the grids further deminished they let the dreaded TZ 700 / 750 in which to all intents killed the class.
Defo a warning to the Classic Club there
We have all got to qualify for our grid position this year Ed. Should make things interesting, looking forward to meeting and competing with the newcomers.
Buddha
I think the old ways are sometimes best, when we drew a disc from a bag so you never started in the same place twice, and the grid was mixed for every race,you could have the winner from the first race then pick a disc that made them start from the rear of the grid in the next race and made for some fantastic chases though the field. It also made for some very tense starts for some if they were on the front and looked back to see who was behind them. The way it is now races sometimes gets a bit like F1 with fastest zooming off and leaves the rest spread out, there were some great battles when it was done the old way.
HI , i have to agree with Richard. Drawing a disc out of the bag made for some good fun ....
As someone who's been in France for a few years now and is as a consequence more than a bit out of touch could someone give me an idea of the difference between the dimensions of a 'modern' F2 and a 'classic' outfit as mentioned in Eddie Wrights and Charlie2s post that gives such a marked difference in handling?
Cheers
Agree with you completely Richard - the old draw your grid slot from a bag was a far beter system. Its all good and well being gridded on a 'known ability' format but when your race rsults arent what they should / could be due to technical issues etc. you face an uphill batle toget to the front slots and spend a season playing catch up and the nearer you get to the front the harder it becomes. The draw system was much fairer and as has ben said many times the fast guys will always win but at least there is a race for all to enjoy as they do so.
Dick has raised an interesting point about the lack of period knowledge our eligibility officer has. How can he be expected to have this knowledge he was not racing sidecars then, and neither were a large percentage of people who compete now.
Personally I think Ian does a very difficult job well. There can be no doubt that he his responsible for the very healthy state of Classic sidecar racing in the UK today, and it is through his endeavors that we will have full grids again this season.
Dick has suggested a sub commitee of people who have knowledge of sidecar racing in the period we race, but I wonder if setting a sub commitee up would be the best idea.
I would suggest asking the people Dick suggested for their opinions of what the class needs in future. This could be recorded in a reference book for the present, and future eligibility officers making life less stressful for them.
The paddock moaners Dick refers to could then be quickly silenced by referring to the book. When F2 first started everything was written down (A new set of rules) Frame diamensions, wheel width contact patch ect,ect. There could be no argument, and best of all we all new exactly where we stood.
I agree with Richard about picking your grid slot out of a bag. Twas the way we did it when i started racing with CRMC in 1990.
I also agree with sidecar bloke being a top man for the CRMC which is why the grids are so good. I'm sure Ian would appreciate the support / advice from those who were around or raced in the period too.
Regards eligibility matters. It certainly sounds like Ian is doing a great job as secretary for the Classic Club.
I think I'm right in saying that Bob B & Keith were founding members of the Classic Club, all be it with a sidecar interest. Bob also being the original sidecar eligibility secretary so he was there when the original rules were drawn up. I'm sure that Bob ( through my contacts with him & seeing the kind of person he is ) would be only too pleased to give Ian the benefit of his knowledge, via pm Sorry for putting you forward Bob
Sidecar Bloke is doing a grand job.I remember when we only had half a dozen sidecars, grid positions from a bag were ok then but not know.Just think novices on the front row and all the 1000cc behind ? SAFER to start with timed grid.
bludge wrote:I agree with Richard about picking your grid slot out of a bag. Twas the way we did it when i started racing with CRMC in 1990.
I also agree with sidecar bloke being a top man for the CRMC which is why the grids are so good. I'm sure Ian would appreciate the support / advice from those who were around or raced in the period too.
Nail on the head there Andy. Ian you are doing a great job Seems there are just a few who like to 'stir' (for want of a better way of putting it).
On the other hand it would be irresponsible to make racing unnecessarily more dangerous than it need be as long as the excitement is still there. Is it worth the calculated risk? (Christ I'm starting to sound like HSE)
IF YOU'VE FORGOTTEN YOUR LOGIN EMAIL ME, WE ARE GOING BACK TO BEING LOGGED IN TO READ. steve@steveenglish.com subject:login and whatever details you remember
richard wrote:We don't race sidecars to be safer, might as well race a pram ,
The 'safety' argument always make me chuckle. Wether it be grid positions, push vs clutch start etc. it is a non argument. Sidecar racing is by its nature inherently dangerous! And before anyone says it I know you can make it safer and this is very true but why can't that be achieved in other ways such as machine preperation? Circuits are quite possibly the safest they have ever been too.
Push starts were always handy for Dad with an NSU that would start with a half a step taken, and some of the 2 strokes used to fire up quick too. Better on clutches with 2 strokes as well, clutch starts on 350's were alwas a lottery, even the krauser used to get through plates.
As for ballot starts, I don't recall there being any more accidents in handicap races I've seen than in 'normal' races so maybe the added danger isn't that great? I couldn't say either way.
IF YOU'VE FORGOTTEN YOUR LOGIN EMAIL ME, WE ARE GOING BACK TO BEING LOGGED IN TO READ. steve@steveenglish.com subject:login and whatever details you remember
Seems there are just a few who like to 'stir' (for want of a better way of putting it).